Trying to figure out what I want
 

I am going to be buying a new-to-me vehicle this summer as I am 21 and still driving my first car. (2000 mustang v6 convertible. Dad wouldn't let me get a GT since he didn't trust me and I was on his insurance.) I am looking for something around an 05-06 Mid-sized SUV for $15-20K. Anyone have experience with the following vehicles or ones to add to the list?

1. Nissan Murano
2. Lexux RX 330
3. Cadillac SRX
4. Mercedes ML 350
etc

Just curious why you are looking at the luxury SUV's?

Caddy will have a lot of rattles at this point, or will start soon.
Lexus is spendy to fix and not all the spectacular.
Nissan isn't bad, but I've only been in one once.
No experience with the Mercedes

I've taken an 04 murano on a 3000 mile road trip and loved it. Looking at reviews, some of those started popping up so i figured i would look into em a little more and prices aren't too far off.

I vote for the nissan just based on reliability and cost of parts. Steer clear of the Lexus. I had one (better lube up before you take it in for anything)

Pure speculation....do not listen to this guy!redflip

Dude wtf..ur 21, not 40. And how are you paying 15-20 grand? Daddy?

Go to school or finish it and get a cheap car until you graduate.

Lifts2

I'm curious as to why the luxury ute as well? Of course, if you are going that way, why not the BMWs? I'd rather have a Tahoe in that price range personally but of the models listed, I've driven the Nissan and I agree that its a really nice vehicle for the money.

Jealous! When I was 21 I was driving an Opel Manta I scraped up $1300 to buy...

I think he is graduating Mr Judgey Mc Judgerson and he has a car, a 2000 Mustang V6. Yeesh. Why do people act as if its a sin to own a nice vehicle?:idk: Btw my 22 year old GF bought a brand new bike cash without help from "Daddy".... I'm guessing he has money saved, is getting money for graduating, has money from selling his bike and even possibly already has a job line up. Shit, for all we know the kid hit the lotto, who cares why he has money, let's just help him decide what vehicle to buy.

Started as an insurance agent late last year. Going to be having a lot of evening meetings that I'll be driving myself to and image makes a big ass difference when you live in a small town. I don't have a wife or kids or anything so I don't have a ton of extra expenses.

P.S. the insurance agency is owned by a bank and I have decent credit so I can get cheap ass rates.

Just really not a fan of how the X3 or X5 in that year range look.

Every time I see an insurance agent drive a nice car, I can't help but think " I wonder how bad he's fucking his clients?" I give out insurance agent / bonding agent shit about that every time he comes to our office.

Independent agents are essentially middle men. No fucking here.

I agree, get the Nissan or something else reliable and not give off the image of "I am fucking you in the ass when you sign with me."

Anyone have experience with other vehicles on the same level as the Murano? I am more interested in foreign than chevy, ford or dodge.

If you decide to go with a BMW/MB/Lexus know that you MAY be able to afford the vehicle, but you DO NOT want to own one unless you know what it costs to own one. AND you want to KEEP it.
Trip knows.....ask about BMW maint for a bike :D
No different for the cars. If you can afford what it takes to properly maintain one, they will last 400k. But you HAVE to be diligent in the maintenance, and be willing to spend the money when and where it's needed.
This is why you don’t see many younger people driving those cars…it’s usually the 45+ crowd. They’re done with buying disposable cars and would rather invest in something long term.
IMHO this also will speak to your potential clients.
Hydrant and Trip are exactly right….whether you’re raping clients or barely making it, the IMPRESSION will be you’re squandering their money.
I’m an engineer, and I don’t make what people perceive engineers to make. But my WIFE does pretty well. As a result we have 2 decent cars, and an explorer. Whenever I go to meet a client or an architect, I ALWAYS drive the explorer. Because if an architect saw me driving a nice car they’d assume our ridiculously LOW fee is WAY too high, and we’d get screwed even harder. So I drive the explorer. Same with a client. I go meet them in the explorer so there isn’t any pretentious impression.
Image is more about how you carry yourself and not what you drive. You can be classy in a pinto

I had thought about that some, didn't realize it was as bad as it is.

It is. This is another reason I have the Kia when I pick up clients at the airport.

As bad as it normally is, it's a 1000000000000x worse right now cause of the economy. People are saving and insurance is something a lot of people think is a luxury, don't give them any little reason you can control to not sign with you. You can still get a decent car without having one of those fancy logos on it. Get a decent used car and then when you got the cash, get yourself a second car for your off hours.

This is very good advise.

My brother in law sells life insurance. He also gets a new car every year. This is something he takes into consideration when he makes a purchase. He currently drives a Ford sedan.

BTW

Does not apply to:

You just can't polish a terd


:lol: :nee:

That old gag.

Guess what...a Buick is your ideal car.

There is something to consider as well is a car from the Big 3 american companies... or if something like Honda is real big in your area due to a factory, get one of those. Show that you're supporting "them".

Have you sat in any new Kia recently? I hate to say it but there stepping up there game. The sorrento is a very nice Crossover and the Forte Coupe is right in line with the civic (I actually think its styled better IMO) And the Optima is also right there with the accord/sonata/camry class.

Kia makes decent auto's for cheaper than the "popular" brands like Honda/Toyo/Mitsubishi.

No doubt the hyundai and kia commercials really have some nice looking cars in them.

I just like giving James shit :nee:

Skip the Lexus... might as well get a Toyota at that point.
BMW... if you're going to go there, get it new as they include maintenance with the purchase [worth it]
Nissan... all the people I know with it are pretty happy with the vehicle. They aren't thrilled enough to talk everyone into buying one themselves, but they have no drama with them.
Caddy... the one friend I have with one regrets it, says it drives "funny" like it's swimming down the freeway at speed. He's had it in for them to fix, just get the answer "nothing wrong, that's how it drives" Pfffffffft.

Good point, buy the local favorite so you are one of them.

There are 2 main dealerships in town; a ford one that is pretty small and a branch of a st louis dealership, and a chevy dealership that has been here forever and is owned by a big businessman in town and a mutual friend.

More than likely, whatever I end up with will have the chevy dealership sticker on the back.

And I know you are just giving me shit :lol:

I actually love that Optima though I'm kinda pissed they just redesigned it again. I'll probably wait a couple more years and get another Optima or a Sorento.

Think you should get the Murano. Thing looks tight, handles well, and it's not too big.

Fuck. Not getting the murano.

why not?

Either the insurance would be murder or because he lives in a 3 horse town and some other cowboy already took that pony to the rodeo!:lol:

kidding, i'll most likely get a murano.

lol, i see what you did there

clever, huh?

Diesel yes, gasser no.

Of what you listed, I'd lean towards the Murano.

Keep in mind though, that it has a CV trans. That might drive me nuts, YMMV.

The Murano is based on a Maxima platform, and the trans did well enough in the Murano that they later offered it in the Max...so I'm sure it's a decent enough unit, but for shits and giggles, I'd find out the service interval on the belt.

I'm with avatard. I hate cvt transmissions. They aren't just in the nissans. I had a dodge caliper rental 2 yrs ago with one in it. Hate hate hate it.

And just buying a car from your local chevy dealer isn't what I mean.

Like I said, if there was a honda or toyota factory nearby then get one of those. In my area, I would say its job suicide for u to not have a gm, ford, chrysler. If u bought a nissan here you would still be viewed as an outsider.

*i'm not starting a american/foreign debate just pointing out what he may need to consider. He's open to public conception/opinion.

The only place for a CVT transmission is in a fucking snowmobile. It's stupid in cars.

This.

I know you posted this asking opinions on specific cars, so you can ignore this opinion if you want, as it has nothing to do with the specific cars.

Honestly, only buy what you can afford to pay for with CASH. If you don't have the cash to buy it, save up for it. Image is a crock of shit. If you get an expensive car, you'll just end up looking like a douche in a small town. Believe in the value of saving toward what you want and forget about spending just to impress other people. I wish I had learned this advice when I was your age. I had older people tell me that all the time and I just ignored them, thinking "I can buy what I want, it's my money and my debt." I'd be so much farther ahead in savings, investing, etc. if I'd taken that advice. And I'd still have the things I wanted because I wouldn't have paid all that money into interest.

Yes, I know, interest rates are fairly low right now. But, you're setting yourself up for a bad habit if you start borrowing now. Do you have any other debt? If so, I'd frankly keep driving the mustang and pay off your other debt, then save to buy what you want. Having ZERO payments on anything is a wonderful feeling. I'm getting close, but still have a ways to go. Be conservative in your spending and aggressive in your saving. You'll be MUCH better off in the future if you ignore that whole "image" bullshit.

www.daveramsey.com FTW

As someone with zero debt, I totally agree with you BUT as someone that has done outside sales, I have to disagree with your "fuck image" sentiment". People like to buy from "one of their own" and nothing succeeds like success, especially in sales. If you appear to be successful, people will buy from you thinking that you must know what you are talking about since so many others have. I also agree that you don't want to go overboard. To be honest, a Mustang would be the perfect sales vehicle around here because it is so popular in these parts. I used to know a guy that would rent a car based on what part of the country he was selling in. He was very successful.

IMO he needs to dump the Mustang, because he's pretty young and the Mustang is only going to reinforce that image. And being young might work against you when selling insurance because most of your customers are going to be older.

The image of insurance is one of stability, and a young Mustang driver doesn't put forth that image. They might think you're just a fly-by-night person from a firm that's gonna fold quickly. IMHO.

Hmm...that's a good point. Well, it's a tight rope for sure.

Ok, I can understand this to a point. However, that doesn't mean young T-rock needs to drop 15-20k on a vehicle. He can still get something reliable that will project an image of stability, without going into debt for it. Then, when he's saved up enough, he can trade in his stable car for a little bit newer stable car. I guess my "fuck image" sentiment was more about "there is no reason to go into debt to impress, even if you're in sales." Show that you're smart with your money and your decisions, be an honest person, and sell the right products to the right people.

I hear you but I'm sorry, if he can get in on <5% rates vs the 2% or less he'll get from a savings account, your argument is null and void, my friend. There is also the old car "payment" to consider. It's a payment that I'm well aware of having used the Bonneville for work driving 300+ miles a day. Maintenance and repairs can cost almost as much as a payment depending on the car and the amount of miles that you travel. Gas mileage may also be a factor. He could potentially half his gas expenditure by buying a newer more efficient vehicle. Speaking of insurance, 21 year old male+Mustang=$$$. If you subtract these factors from his monthly payment, he may potentially break even.

Do you honestly see him spending 15-20k on the mustang, or some other used car, in repairs and maintenance? And what about the cost of insurance for a 21 year old male for a newer vehicle, especially an SUV that has higher repair costs. Not to mention the fact that the vehicles he's looking at are going to get as bad of gas mileage as his V6 mustang.

Screw what everyone else says, buy yourself a Subaru Imrpeza (non-WRX, non-STI, just the regualr imprezza), slightly more expensive than you wanted to spend, but the 5 door hatch is decent on insurance, decent on gas, fun to drive, says that you are responsible, smart, practical, you are good with your money, and that you also like a quality car.

http://www.globalmotors.net/wp-conte...iversary-3.jpg

Can't go wrong with a Subaru.

Over a 6 year period? Yes. I have receipts totally over $2000 from repair costs on the Bonneville in 2010. BTW if he buys at a dealership, I'd imagine that he'll get the warranty on the vehicle or at least it will come with a drive train warranty, right? :idk: Btw we're both wrong, I ran a quote with Nationwide on a 2000 Mustang V6 Conv and a 2006 Nissan Murano, the Nissan was $6/month cheaper so no big deal.:lol: Also, the gas mileage is about the same so again, mia culpa.:lol: The only things that I will stand by are the premises that the Murano will present a better image, be more dependable and possibly cost less to maintain. Oh and with the super low interest rates cost next to nothing to finance and be "slightly" more comfortable to transport more than two people....:lol:

Yep...almost as much as I hate "PIN Numbers", and "Hot Water Heaters" ;)

There isn't a belt in a CVT in a car.

I live in Missouri. Hatchback cars are for 16 year old kids that spend as much on the body kit, rims and neon as the car is worth.

I didn't mean image on the car alone. Like tigger said, showing success makes a big difference around here. One of my biggest obstacles at this point is people not knowing if I will still be here in another 4 months, but that will just take time.

I would almost lean away from the SVU aspect and look more towards a nice sedan, that can also be sporty, supporting both aspects for you. The fun non work side, but the classy agent in the nice car. Good gas mileage, get something you know will be dependable, I had a top of the line Altima and it was stellar, and I know a ton of folks who are in LOVE with their maximas.

To me, the SVU is more soccer mom, whereas the sedan is more well rounded. but it's all your call in the end babe.

But do you really need to spend 15-20k of borrowed money to do it? Spending money that you haven't even earned yet, in a commission structured job that is VERY difficult, isn't exactly the best gameplan. What if you DON'T make it at this job? What if you can't get a job quickly if this one bombs? What if you don't earn as much commission as you expect? How will you make the car payments? This is my main point.

If the mustang is a bad representation, then trade it in, along with some cash, on a car that is sturdy and reliable, and has an image of responsibility. Just don't go into debt to do so. When you PROVE to people that you are still going to be in this job, by actually BEING in the job, then trade up in cars, with CASH you've earned at the job.

Starting out in insurance sales is VERY difficult. I know because I've been there. I drove myself deep into debt, thinking the same shit you're thinking. It took me several years to get out of that hole and I don't want to see a good guy make the same mistakes I did. Do your damndest to stay out of debt along the way. Then, when the residuals start rolling in, you'll be in an awesome spot.

Having success is being able to afford a new luxury car where the MSRP doesn't exceed 1/3 of your annual salary, in some cases picking an auto that makes your peer's wife say "I like your car".

Faking success is spending money on a car you couldn't afford when new with hopes it will impress those with minimal success.

If you are in retail insurance, then
1. Midlevel Buick
2. Camry or Avalon
3. Chevy Malibu or Impalla
4. Ford Taurus

If you need AWD, get an AWD Taurus.
If you work handle commercial insurance, then Buick.

Conservative car...conservative styling. Cleanliness, 4doors

The fact is that you are still a kid. You need something that says "Company car issued to low level sales guy"
The car should not say something about you. It should say something about the company you represent.
Since it is insurance NO LUXURY BRANDS UNTIL YOU LOOK THE PART (meaning you look like you have been in the industry for 20 years aka. You are in your 40's)
Safe, conservative, low risk.

But don't forget to consider the risk involved with going into debt. That risk is MUCH higher with a commission structured job, such as the one he has. I stand by my statement that he doesn't need to go into debt on a vehicle in order to present a good image. Maybe the mustang presents an image of immaturity and he wants to present a better image to potential clients. Fine, I can handle that. However, he doesn't need to go 15 or 20k in debt to present an image of stability and maturity. He can pick up a used Camry for 5 or 6k (or any reliable vehicle that has a better image than the 'stang). If he trades in the mustang and pays cash for a used vehicle, he's ahead of the game. He can then trade into a better vehicle down the road after he starts seeing some residuals from prior sales. I think pauldun hit this one on the head with his post on "image."

I think that Ramsey needs to start a church....:lol: Avery, not everyone is going to wreck their lives going into debt. I'm not telling the kid to buy a Porsche but if he ever plans on buying a house someday, unless you Ransey-ites don't allow credit for that anymore, he's going to have to build some credit. Buying a car is a good way to do that. You nor I know the EXACT situation he is in but the Mustang has some value for trade against the new vehicle and for all you know, he may already have some cash. Again, my 22 year old GF bought a $10,000 bike cash last year. It's amazing how much a "kid" working part time can save when Mom and Dad are paying the bills...:lol:

Anyway, here's an example of what I'm trying to say, $15,000 Murano - $4,500 trade for the Mustang - $2,500 cash = $8,000 loan with a $166/month payment @5% over 60 months. You could donate plasma to make that payment. I agree with you and the Reverend Ramsey for the most part with these two exceptions; 1. a house and 2. a vehicle. are the only reasons I'll take out a loan/go into debt ever again.

Gotta agree with Paul on this. I've been in this industry for a decade now and this is pretty much spot on.

I actually agree with the vehicle choice from a professional standpoint but the kid's 21 for God's sake!!!:lol: I would go this route if he can afford to keep the 'Stang and buy one of these cars for work.

No matter what, I'm not going to go into debt for a car I don't enjoy and will want to get rid of within 6 months.

You're right, we don't know his exact situation. And like you said, it's amazing how much someone working part time can save while Mom and Dad are paying the bills. It's also amazing how much ANY person can save when they have zero debt.

What I'm trying to get through is that debt is a very bad habit to get into. There is zero REAL reason for him to finance a vehicle at this stage of the game. Come up with all the excuses you want, but he honestly does not NEED a new car, at least not to the point of financing one. If he truly NEEDS a different car due to the image that he thinks his current one portrays, then the mustang can be traded in, along with some cash, for a more reliable car that portrays a better, more stable image. He can then save a standard car payment for 10 months, then trade in the "stable-image" car in, along with the cash he saved, for a slightly better "stable-image" car. There is no need to finance a car.

And 60 months on a car loan? That Murano will be worth less than what he owes on it in about 2 years if he finances it for 5 years, which will then leave him upside down on it, should he decide he wants to "trade up" in 2 years, which is the standard for our society. And since it seems that image is so important here, it's highly likely he'll want to trade up for a better image in two years.

As for buying a home, yeah, Ramsey's idea allows for financing a house, under specific conditions. 1. Have a 20% down payment saved up. 2. Finance ONLY at 15 years with a fixed rate mortgage. 3. Make sure the payment at that 15 year rate is no more than 25% of your NET pay (I'll add that I feel it should even be mortgage payment, plus prop taxes, plus insurance should not total more than 25% of take home pay).

How will he "build credit" to get a loan for that house? By renting at the same place for at least two years and always paying his rent on time. While that's not reported on his credit report, it still shows stability and that he can make the payments. Also, because he'll have good financial habits with no debt, he'll also be investing while saving for the down payment of his home and will have additional assets to show the bank. Combine all of that with the above criteria plus a worthwhile bank that looks at the overall picture, not just a credit score, and he can get a loan for a home, without the need to go into debt on a car, or anything else.

Really wish that said:

I know I'm fighting a losing battle, because the vast majority of people think there is nothing wrong with debt and everybody has all sorts of reasons why "reasonable" debt is a good thing. The problem is, the vast majority of people fall into bad habits with debt. Rather than saving up for what we want, and truly earning it before having it, we get caught up in the "I must have it now" philosophy and we come up with a multitude of ways to rationalize it. I know, I've been there, and I'm digging myself out of it.

I also have a degree in finance and I've been taught all the reasons why debt is a good thing. Problem is, I've never met a truly wealthy person that has all this debt. Everybody I know with debt wishes they didn't have that debt. They all wish they could get out from under it. They all wish they didn't have those payments, myself included.

I rationalized financing my motorcycle. After all, it was only 1.9% interest and I didn't have a car payment, so I could afford the payment. I fell into that "must have it now" trap. I thought I would be fine, then some unexpected things came about and I ran into some financial issues that caused me to realize I would have been much better off without the debt. And guess what? That payment is less than the amount Lon came up with for your payment, t-rock. Yet, I still wish I didn't have that payment.

Luckily, I was able to get things turned around and I'm working on paying off the debt early. I know you think I'm being too conservative, and I know you think I'm foolish and that you know better than me. I know you think "that won't happen to me," because I've been in your shoes. I said all of those things, too.

So with that, I'm done. This horse is sufficiently beaten well beyond death. Good luck, and I hope to hell you never have to say, "damn, I wish I'd listened to those old fogeys when they tried to give me advice." Because I sure as hell wish I'd listened to people my age and older back when I was your age.

Truth.

Taurus = boring, even the new ones. Not sure why some people think they're great all of a sudden just because of the re-style.

Buick = boring as well..... nobody your age drives them, and nobody is going to be fooled into thinking it's a company car either.

Camry = OK but boring (sorry paul), and the Avalon is even worse, it's a grandmother's car and rides like a boat.

Malibu/Impalas are OK, but if you want a 4-door I would get either a G6, Mazda 6, or Altima. They fit your age alot better.

If I were going to get a sedan it would be an altima for sure. Reason I am looking at the crossover cars is because I am tired of having a car I can't move or haul anything in. I have way too many times that I can't fit stuff in my car and have to borrow someones or take 6 trips or we have 4 people squashed into my car. We took my buddy's murano out to boston and back and got 23-24 mpg including all of the highways and then all around manhattan and boston. That's better than I get in the mustang with the same driving habits.

Again, this is still about 5-7 months out so I will have a pretty good idea by then of what I am going to be making and if I am going to succeed at it.

Ok, so your heart is set on the Murano, all other advice be damned. At least do this:

1. Find out tomorrow what your payment would be on the Murano.
2. Find out what the cost of registration, road taxes, etc. will be on the Murano. Is it more than the Mustang?
3. Find out what the insurance cost will be on the Murano. Is it more than the Mustang?

Next, open a savings account (unless you already have one with little to no balance). Now, set aside the money you'll need for registration. For the next 5 to 7 months, make the monthly payment, combined with whatever extra you'll need for insurance over and above what you pay for the stang, directly into your savings account. Finally, do not remove this money, under ANY circumstances, from that savings account until you are ready to buy the Murano (or a different vehicle if you change your mind between now and then).

If you cheat on this process over the next 5 to 7 months, or you ever wish you didn't have to make that payment to yourself, then I highly advise you don't purchase that vehicle.

If you can't at LEAST do the above, then I wish you a lot of luck in your future.

Avery,
1. T-Rock doesn't require an "excuse" to buy a car... Some people on this forum don't believe people should EVER buy a new/nice car and jump up every time anyone even mentions it. I don't think that anyone needs to justify their buying habits to you or anyone else, the kid asked for CAR ADVICE, not fear mongering.

2. It really sucks that you are dishing out advice that you yourself didn't heed just a year or so ago. I mean, there is a huge difference between buying a car for work and buying a motorcycle. In fact, our friend here SOLD his motorcycle to better his financial picture...maybe you should take advice from him.

3. The absolute BEST investment advice someone in your personal position could give T-Rock would be to invest in a vacectomy/ condoms considering that a large reason that you can't afford things is the child you brought into this world out of wedlock.

4. T-Rock is single, childless and AFAIK still living with his parents so I think that he can afford a $200/month payment. I believe that he already has a father so...besides, his Dad seems to be very involved in his life and helps him make decisions. I doubt he'll let our boy get too far into trouble.

heart set on the murano? You do realize I came into this with a few different vehicles I was looking at and completely open to others opinions. I have no wife and kids using up all of my money. I am one of two people I know still driving my first car after almost 6 years and frankly I'm tired of it.

Captain, I realize the dangers of debt, and that is why I don't plan on ever having a payment on a bike. Don't plan on going into debt for a toy. A new car however, I am willing to give up a little bit of my play money every month for.

I don't know if matters much, but check to see what the Murano takes as far as gas octane. Some friends have one and IIRC they have to put 93 in it according to the book. They have had the Murano for 4-5 years now and haven't had a problem with it, and probably has close to 80K on the odo.

I'm pretty sure you are right about it calling for premium.

His original list
1. Nissan Murano - Boring with a lift kit
2. Lexux RX 330 - Boring with a lift kit
3. Cadillac SRX - Problematic boring with a lift kit
4. Mercedes ML 350 - Problematic boring with a lift kit
etc

Taurus - Conservative sedan with reasonable pricing in the used market and most importantly available with AWD. A very big plus with the Taurus is usable interior space. Lots of room inside front and rear for clients and co workers of all sizes. Big old trunk for lugging around paperwork and other necessities.

Buick - Conservative sedan with reasonable pricing in the used market and likely to be very well taken care of by previous owner. Big pluses are MPG, comfort, insurance and decent drivetrain.

Camry - Get a 4banger and it will be great on gas, cheap to own and insure. Late model SE models handle reasonably well.

Avalon - See Taurus. Additional pluses with Avalon are MPG and power (actually fairly quick cars)

Malibu/Impalas - Solid all rounders. Pricing not to bad on used car market.


Mazda6 - For his price range he is looking at the last gen model. Problematic and tight back seats.

G6 - No for too many reasons.

Altima - An ok choice but it depends on the area.

No...but you do still live at home so you are the leach.


If you want to get a Murano (or whatever else) then go get one.
Your not getting a car for work (because the image thing is bs).
Your looking at getting a new car because you are tired of your old car, you have money in your pocket and no immediate financial obligations.

Get whatever strikes your fancy (I'd stay clear of all luxury\german brands in your price range. )
My only recommendation is that whatever you purchase not exceed a 1/3 of your annual gross salary and to be very careful with long term finance plans.

Nissan Altima's are solid cars with a nice balance of handling, power, reliabilty and room.

Since when is an insurance agent going to take clients out to lunch or anything. Maybe in 3-4 years after you've gotten to know the person. But that's pushing it. And certainly not your client's entire family.

As for coworkers, fuck em, agents/salespeople don't care about each other, and rarely work together other than during training sessions.

G6 = Malibu same thing, so how can one be great and the other not?

Mazda 6 problematic, as in mechanical issues? I doubt it has as many issues as most VW's. And if the automatic is a problem area, then just get a manual.

An Altima I agree is the best choice for your age. For some reason that car really gained a youth following back in the early 2000's when it got restyled. Maybe it was the new sharp creases & the "tight" lights it had (think it had those 'altezza' style lights)

Another choice would be a Subaru.........A Legacy if u want a conservative yet still trendy & decent-performing 4-door..........Or a Forrester for an SUV.

How come nobody has mentioned a Lotus Elise?:?:

Thank you for underscoring every point I'm trying to make.

1. I stated in my first post on the subject that I was aware he asked for car advice and he was free to ignore my advice. You decided to give me every reason (or rather excuse) why my advice was wrong. I countered your arguments. T-rock said he was basically set on the Murano but will likely be waiting 5-7 months, so I gave him a very good exercise simply to ensure he can afford the payments. He's wise and financially savvy, yet he's blowing off even that advice.

2. I'm giving this advice because I really wish someone would have given me this advice just shy of a year ago. And I'm not saying he should not "buy a car for work." I'm saying he should not go into debt for a car. Period. Whether for work or otherwise. I've pointed out all of the reasons not to do so. I also sold my motorcycle almost 6 years ago to better my financial position. Guess what line of work I was going into. Insurance sales, same as t-rock. Guess what line of work got me deep into debt. Insurance sales. Why? Because it's a very unstable job that is very difficult to get off the ground. Just another reason to avoid going into debt on a car. That doesn't mean he has to keep the mustang, it just means to buy what he can actually afford, without going into debt.

3. Yes, I have a child out of wedlock and I'm paying support, legal fees, etc. While t-rock may never be in this exact situation (I hope he never is), my point is that anything can happen, at anytime, to anyone. He doesn't NEED to go into debt. I've been pointing out the pitfalls and very valid reasons not to do so. He's in a very unstable job, where it is very difficult to earn a living. Hell, he doesn't even know how much he's going to be earning, which is why he's waiting 5-7 months to buy (at least he's waiting). But he could at least take the advice of learning what the payment will be, along with additional cost increases, and set that amount aside every single month. What's wrong with that?

4. He's still living with his parents so he can afford $200 per month. Awesome. Now, what about when he wants to move out? Can he afford that $200 payment on top of rent, food, utilities, and all of the other things he needs/wants? Again, a pretty damn good reason to not go into debt. I have parents that are very involved in my life and still give me advice. Guess what they told me when I decided I was going to buy a motorcycle on credit? "You deserve it. You've been waiting 5 years to buy another one. Good for you." If they would have told me to wait and not buy on credit, and give me the advice and information I'm trying to provide to t-rock, I'd be in a much better spot right now. But I'm lucky and I'm able to dig out of that spot. I'm just trying to help t-rock avoid the pitfalls by giving him information against it. By the way, when I bought the motorcycle, I could also afford the payment. You've argued every reason why I'm wrong, using every excuse I've used in my past, thus underlining the very reasons I'm giving the advice. It's not fear mongering. It's real world advice from someone who has been in the kids exact shoes and made the same decisions he's making right now. Hell, he might make 200k in his first year of insurance sales and go on to be the highest grossing insurance producer in the U.S. and he may never have a single financial problem in his life. That doesn't mean he needs to go into debt on a car at this stage of the game. Give me one valid reason why he NEEDS to go into debt to buy a car. He can get a better car with a better image without going into debt to do so.

I'm glad you're still driving your first car after 6 years. I've been in your shoes. I thought I was making all the right financial decisions in my life, too. Guess what. They were all the same decisions you're making now (see my answers to Lon above). As far as me "going into debt on a toy," what is the difference between me having a motorcycle payment with zero car payment, and having a car payment with zero motorcycle payment? I'm still in debt on one of them, no matter which way you slice it. I made the mistake of going into debt when I didn't NEED to, just like you don't really NEED to go into debt on a car.

You want something different than the mustang? Great, I'm all for you trading it in and getting something different. I'm just advising that you don't go into debt. You have 5-7 months to review the information I've given you. I'm just trying to give you information to help you out now. It won't hurt you one bit to truthfully review the information and really understand it. It won't hurt you in the least to find out what your payment and other "extras" are going to cost, then save that amount of money for 5-7 months, even if you choose to ignore the advice about staying out of debt.

...or an S2000?

Why shoot so low.

Corvette z06

paul so dumb...can't even read the op's wants right.

Are you saying that he will stagnate in his career?

Dead brand, early G6's are known to be problematic. Malibu has better drivetrain choices and more room

3.0 duratec in the car has shitty throttle body design. When it goes south its a pricey replacement. 2.3 also has some issues.

be tee dubbs, i live in my own place. very reasonable rent, cheapest cable & internet, decent utilities, overall live on a college budget.

Shiite

I change my answer to Ferrari 308 or Mondial. That should fit into his budget

We've done a good thing here today paul. It's all about helping people in need.

Shitty throttle body ........mkay, so you mean it either leaks, or sticks, or........??

Because otherwise it's not that complex of a part......

If anything, the duratec is simpy loud & obnoxious.......but that's due to valvetrain noise..

Ford junk....

Ford & Chrysler should just buy all their engines & trannies from GM, seriously..

Then why did you recommend the Mazda6 :lol:

Cuz it looks & handles good :shrug:

Handles great BUT
Shits coils.....
Engine likes to grenade (exhaust\precat design)
Depending on year...shitty PCV design (shout out to VW\Audi)

Should be on the avoid list for any used car shopper

WHAT!?!?!?!?! Then don't buy shit retard! :lol:

Shit Avery, it sounds like the REAL advice you should give is NOT to get into the insurance game in the first place!!!!:lol: I've gotten at least a dozen Insurance Sales offers in the last couple years and they go right into the trash! Intangible sales FTL!

BTW I'm honestly sorry if this got too personal but truth be told on average, a guy could buy two or three cars with what most suckers end up paying in child support over 18 years. I have seen people pay out enough per month to easily make a payment on a new bike/car. My best financial advice is to get fixed!:wink:

Yeah, insurance sales is a bitch. It can be highly profitable, but a guy needs to go at it very cautiously, which means limiting all expenses as much as possible the first few years. Probably really need to start out with 2 years expenses saved up in order to make it at the game.

No worries, my feelings aren't hurt. I'm well aware of the reality of my situation. And you're correct, I could have a very nice car (or several bikes) with what I pay in child support. It's fucking ridiculous.

Cool, I didn't want to appear too harsh, just honest. Hopefully, our boy avoids what I like to call, "the one financial pitfall Dave Ramsey doesn't address", ie having kids! I don't really know if people truly understand just how expensive the little rugrats are or how much better their lives would be financially if they didn't have them. Seriously, two are not as cheap to take care of as one, etc. If people planned having kids out even on tenth as much as D.R. wants them to plan to buy a house or a car....:lol: Heck, the commitment with raising a child is much longer than buying a car and even longer than Dave wants you to commit to buying a house (15 years vs 18).:whosr:

Yeah, I definitely hope he avoids that pitfall. Kids are definitely expensive, but I think the courts are way off base on their calculations of cost and support. It's ridiculous that they base the cost of the child from the income of the two parties. It doesn't cost any more to raise a kid if the parents make 100k or 30k. While people may choose to spend more on shit for their kids when they make more money, the actual cost of raising the child doesn't change. If I were married to my daughter's mom, I wouldn't allow spending anywhere near the amount on my daughter that the courts dictate. It's absolutely assanine.

[/hijack]

^^^ like anyone cares what's going on in this thread... We've been debating a car purchase that may or may not happen in 5-7 months involving a kid that is starting a particular job that he may or may not even have by that time.:lol:

I agree to an extent with the proviso that not all "sperm donors" can afford some amounts... IE a guy that makes minimum wage can't afford $100/week. I do believe that it should be a percentage of pay but up to a reasonable cap. I mean Tiger Woods kids get more in support than most of us put together make working, that's ridiculous.

Seriously, some of those electronic throttle bodies can cost up to 2k. Parts in cars today are not cheap.

Agree 100%. Unless your selling to a company, they will probably never see your car.

I'm going to be doing a fair bit of commercial ins.