1975 Kawasaki Triple
 

My 650R is about to get a dinosaur for a stable mate. Pops is getting an old triple. It's either a 500 or 550cc. He went to look at it yesterday, and it sounds like it's in decent shape. Little rust, small tank dent, but it turns over and all the parts are on it. Probably needs tires, spark plugs, carb rebuild/synch- so guess what he's getting for christmas LOL Neither of these is his, but I like the old cafe racer look on these things. He'll probably keep the mini sissy bar and tall handlebars it has though. He's paying $100 for it- can't beat that, even if it needed completely rebuilt. Anyone know anything about them? I remember seeing a few sig lines of members that had them. What tires does it take? Tubes? Bias-Ply?

http://sites.estvideo.net/triple-pas...AKI_500_H1.jpg
http://www.motoretro.com.au/gallery/...0cc_Triple.jpg

his is likely going to be an H1 500 triple. they use a bias ply tube tire. fun bikes with performance pipes and the proper tuning. I've heard the front brakes were teh suck. if you get discs, I'd imagine its not terrible.

a 2 stroke bike will CERTAINLY make you relearn motorcycle riding. you gotta stay in the powerband, or you're not gonna get movin very fast.

i hear the suspensions are somewhat scary and the powerband is ridiculous when it hits. try pm'ing 71h1triple (i think thats it) on here, he is currently restoring one and has past experience

I've heard the same stuff about the suspension and brakes. They're a BLAST to ride though.

I tried an RD250 yesterday, and I'm not gonna lie, that was probably the most fun I've EVER had on a bike. hella big learning curve to ride though.

I fucking love those things. I swear I saw one the other day except it had dirtbike tires.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zuXSsDEzCk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buga91RLVHg

I do remember someone saying that Kawasaki H1/h2 almost has the frame technology of a walmart bicycle, braking power of the flinstone mobile but it's all good once you hit the throttle.

I've ridden and worked on many of them. They are not bad bikes for the day. Steering head bearing and swingarm bushings need to be checked, but by 75' they handled and stopped as well as most bikes that size. Just have it pointed in the direction you intend to go by the time the clock hits 6000 RPM and you will be fine. Mucho fun. A 500 Kaw was the first bike I ever rode that would, just by dropping a gear to pass a car at 50 or so, pass said car on the rear wheel without really meaning to. The 500 and 750's made enough torque to ride fine under the power band, it just gets much more interesting when you ride the pipe.

Someone called ? :idk:

The top picture is the "newer" style ( '73 to '76 ) which has a disk brake up front and CDI ignition. The bottom picture is a '71 H1A which is a points style ignition and has drum brakes. That style was '69 to '72.

Here's a link to the Kawasaki Triple Resource page which has tons of info on pretty much everything he'll need to know.
http://kawtriple.com/mraxl/

Make he reads this section as it's directed to new owners.
http://kawtriple.com/mraxl/newbies.htm

Have your Dad register on http://kawasakitriplesworldwide.com/phpBB2/index.php . It will take a few days to be approved ( had a bad spam problem in the past which implemented this, sorry ) but if you PM your dad's user name, I'll send an email to the Mod that handles this and it *may* make it quicker.

There are a lot of very knowledgeable people on the Triple board who are more than willing to help out. A good search function too.

So exactly what year did your Dad get? Any pics of it? At $100 for any decent looking, complete triple, he did quite well.

He should resist the temptation to fire it up until it's been gone over to make sure he doesn't have a catastrophic failure. It would be better to purchase a few parts than have to replace major components.

I'm JRD on the triple forum.

Jeff

From 1975 to 1979, I rode two-stroke triples. Suzuki's GT 550 and 750. I hopped them up, but they were no match in a straight line with the Kawasaki's. Back then, you could buy two-stroke oil in any drug store. Now I do a double-take even if I see the oil in a motorcycle shop.

keep the high handlebars? I had my 79 Suzuki for one day before I changed the buckhorn bars to superbike bars. Steel brake lines, GG pads, fork brace, and Metzeler Lasertec tire will vastly improve the front.

Works Performance shocks (longest ones possible) and Lasertec tire will bring up the rear, literally.

Some more ideas

For much better stopping, a very easy upgrade is a swap to a EX front caliper ( and MC if you want). You can pick up both a caliper and a master cylinder for around $50. A very simple adapter is all that is required to bolt that one. The drawing for the adapter is on the resource page.

There are quite a few good people offering services on the triple website. Damon Kirkland is know as "the crank god" for rebuilding triple crankshafts.

A couple people offer cylinder boring and "Ja-Moo" makes reed kits for them.

The fine folks on the forum really don't care if he builds a "rat rod" or a concours correct restoration. They're just genuinely happy to see another triple get back on the road ( or the race track ).

The parts for sale section and the parts wanted section are a good place to get what he needs. Ebay is another spot but some sellers are better than others. He should ask if he's going that way since there are a few who are know to "misrepresent" the condition of the parts. One of the members there is Jessh1 who comes highly recommended by almost the entire forum. His ebay store is "Jessbikes". I personally deal with him and he stands behind his parts. No junk from Jess.

Feel free to ask any questions and I'm help as much as I can.

Jeff

:iagree: He speaks the truth. Highbars are for show but not for safe riding :willy:

I rode two-stroke street bikes for 8 years before I got my first four-stroke. I remember the first time I came down Lookout Mountain with my GS1000. Engine braking. Wow. But going the other way, from a four-stroke to a two-stroke, would be eye-opening when you close the throttle and expect the engine to slow you down.

And by the way, those Suzuki GT's were not peaky at all. A Suzuki GT750 with a Gixxer front end, clubman bars, and Bassani expansion chambers would look and sound so cool.

fuckin build it. :dthumb:

WOW- H1, No Worries, thanks for all the info! I just emailed dad the links. I'll let you know when he signs up. We were running errands today and looked a few places for a Haynes or Clymers manual- couldn't find one, but I'll check a few dealers tomorrow.

The guy he's getting it from doesn't seem to know much about it. Good guy, but it sounds like he got some misinformation. He says he cleaned/rebuilt the carbs, and that it was run on the street not too long ago. Problem is, he said it's a four-stroke, and it sounds like the carbs are all out of whack, and the petcock may leak. Unfortunately, I haven't seen the thing firsthand yet. Apparently, the title only says it's a 1975 Kawasaki 500. I've told dad the first thing we need to do is replace the tubes, tires, and brake lines, and rebuild/synch the carbs.

:drool: I'm looking forward to riding this thing. It'll mostly be used as a commuter, so that 78mpg sounds great, and the 60hp and 42ft-lbs sounds frightening with skinny tires and old components.

"High bars" to me are like the stockers on my 650R. It probably has the stock bars on it still. I'm sure I'd go to superbike bars or clipons, but it's dad's bike, so whatever he's comfortable with. As long as he's safe, fine with me.

I hate high handlebars. lower ones look and feel much better.


On a side note, I have a friend selling a complete GT750triple motor and some misc parts for one here local to me if anyone is interested in it. I'll even crate it and handle the shipping if you're wanting it enough.

if its anything like my kz, you'll probably hate clip ons, but they look sweet. same with the clubman bars.

superbike bars are usually the most comfy, for old dudes and young ones alike from what ive seen-i liked em

My friend's dad actually has clipons on his 75 RD350, they change the riding position a fair bit over the stock bars. superbike bars are pretty much perfect IMO. My buddy, whose dad has the 75 RD, has a 73 RD 250 of his own, with superbike bars on it that are pretty nice. you can change the riding position by where your ass is on the seat.

on a side note, 2 stroke bikes are SHOCKINGLY light things compared to sportbikes. I rode the 73 RD 250, and kinda forgot there was a bike under me except for the moving and holding a clutch in thing. I think thats a great thing about simpler bikes, they tend to be light.

Yeah! What he said...:rockwoot:

From the links, looks like the H1 weighs a bit more than my 650R.:idk:

Good point here, the H1 is a triple, and has a fairly large amount of running gear on it, making it heavier. the RD I rode is literally bare essentials, no fender on the front, minimalist gauges(tach only) and its RETARDEDLY light. something like 250 pounds or so at most, cause me and my buddy can pick it up from each end by ourselves and carry it.

Both the Haynes and the Clymer have some mistakes in them. He can download the Glenn's manual off the resource link. That has both general maintence and performance tips in it. Best book you could buy and you can download it for free.

Where did the 78mpg come from? :idk: You'll get 30 or so if your lucky. These were made for mileage, they were made to kick ass.

Superbike bars are the way to go. Just slightly lower than stock and they help keep the front end down.

If you give a description and some type of contact info, I'll post it up on the triple forum.

Jeff

looks like a ton of fun (both to ride and wrench on)

:iagree: Parts are fairly easy to get ( some are still available from kawasaki ) and the bikes are a ton of fun too.

I just sent you a PM about it. next time I'm over there I'll take some time and photograph the engine if I remember my camera.

Next Question
 

Anyone know where to find keys for really old bikes? Got one with the triple, but it would be really nice to have a spare. We've checked some dealers, and Kawi discontinued most of the '75 parts in '90. Can't find a blank anywhere. May end up having a locksmith grind a riding lawnmower key to fit :lol:

The RD250 & 350 weigh in at about 310. Stripped for racing they come in around 285 lb's wet. My Rd's that I raced would make about 50 HP (avg, about 65 when cool). They are small, light and fast. They can make for a pretty exciting ride, but they do require a lot of concentration to ride fast.

I got a buddy who swears his RD weighs in at around 200 or less. how credible that is without a scale to verify though is very questionable.

They certainly do require concentration to be quick on, no doubt from the time I've spent on my friend's old one.

What key number do you need? If it's 911 or 919, prepare to dig very deep in your pocket for a NOS key.

If you just want a copy, blanks are easy to get.

If you don't want to post the key number, PM me and I'll help you out.

Jeff

200 lbs! What is it with the engine and forks installed? :)

They are light enough to weigh on bathroom scales. Just weight the front, then the rear and add the numbers. It will be close enough.

I just need a copy. Thought you had to go to a dealer for a blank. But this thing looks close enough to a lawnmower key :lol:

yeah, he says thats what it weighs with everything assembled, in road ready trim. I know it weighs more like 270+, I just dont wanna argue with him about it cause I dont like arguing with idiots.

Yeah, no point. But he's full of shit.
When I drag raced RD's I put one on the scales at the track, but they really aren't made to weigh something that light. If I recall, it came up at 268lbs. That was with struts and wheelie bars which might weigh a little more than rear shocks, Aluminum seat and not much else, maybe a half gal of fuel. One of the biggest chunks of weight that you can take off of them is the stock pipes and foot pegs. Chambers and rearsets probably knock 12 lbs off the bike and add mondo corner clearance. Then remove the oil tank, oil pump, fenders, alternator, charging system, lights, gauges and anything else that will come off without a torch you lose another 15 or so lbs. Aluminum rims take another pound or two off. Stock, the RD350 weighed 308 dry, so if you managed to pull 30 lbs of stuff off, it would still come in at 278Lbs dry.

Exactly. I know his bike is light, but sub 250 pound range? just not possible, cause I know he's got fenders, stock pegs, the charging system, full tank and such.

Let me know the key number, I might have a key blank.

The key blanks I have here are for the ODD numbers between 911 and 919.

OR

go to www.key-men.com and get a blank from them. Email them, describe the cycle ( year, make model & key number) and they'll make sure you get the correct blank.

They can also "cut from code" if you would loose the key but still have the number.

Jeff

I think you are getting the key blank number confused with the key code. The key blank number isn't the cuts of the key, that's the key code

The triples have the key code stamped in the ignition, steering lock and seat lock. I have three different keys in the correct range that may fit his cycle, 911, 915 and 919. The Kawasaki key blank is number 1025 for the odd numbered keys above.

If you were to purchase a YH40 blank from key-men, they could cut the correct code to the blank.

Is that clearer on what I was explaining?

Jeff

Well, I don't think it even has the original key. It's stamped Taylor...

Taylor is copy. Is there numbers on the ignition switch and the same number on the seat lock?

See how the number is stamped around where the key goes in? It's the same on the ignition switch.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7..._286374H1E.jpg

( this bike is next to be restored, it's a 74 H1 500 )

It's a 911.

Since it's Christmas, I'll give you the key in picture. It's an Ilco blank that was cut from an original key that works in my ignition and seat locks.

PM me your name and address and I'll mail it to you on friday. :dthumb:

Jeff

*sigh* All ready to start it today, and we got carb issues. Took all three carbs off, cleaned them out really well, got all the varnish out of the tank, poured in new fuel, and it poured right out the left two carbs and down the engine. Looking for new float needle and seats now...

Check you floats to make sure they do float ( use gas to check, not water)

Also, some of the rebuild kits on ebay are JUNK. Research the triple forum for good kits.

Thinking about this overnight, you probably only need to clean the carbs well and replace the gaskets ( if they tear)

To clean the carbs, use the berkebile gum cutter. Best stuff I've ever used
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...DCP_3033JF.jpg

If you need to purchase parts that aren't available at the dealer, I would use either Jessbikes on Ebay or MidAtlantic Cycle. Both are "good" members of the triple forum. I use Jess Bikes for most everything myself.

Key will be mailed late this morning. :dthumb:

Jeff

We started with cleaning them- before we put fuel in the tank. After it started pouring out, we adjusted the floats where the needle rests, and checked with a mityvac. The right side is fine, the left is holding fuel after adjustment, but the center is shot. He's calling around today for parts.

I'm driving over to Jess' house tomorrow. Want me to check if he have anything you need? I'll PM you Jess' email and you can contact him yourself if you want.

Jess is a stand up guy and doesn't sell junk. If something turns out not to be good, it's not a problem returning it. :dthumb:

Jeff

One other thing to check --- the petcock.

Make sure it's in the "ON" position and not in the "prime" position. The prime position will make the carbs overflow.

Well, it runs- sorta. On one and a half cylinders. The left side is firing fine, the center is flaky, and the right not at all. Got the overflow problem fixed though- Dad got the only float needle and seat in 60 miles. Still have a slow leak from a pinhole in the right fuel line. Found a weird crystal formation on it today- fuel must have atomized coming out the hole and frozen. Definitely have spark on all three, so that's a good thing. Did a compression test too- in the range of 135-150 all three.

Hmmm.... I'll bet that's part of it. I never really looked- just figured it needed new seals. Should only flow in "ON" when it has engine vacuum right? Well, we just found the tube broke where it goes up and around under the tank :lol:

You sir, are a fine human being :dthumb:

STOP-- Do NOT run the bike until this has been checked

Sitting on the bike, under the right side side cover is the two stoke oil injection tank. There is a screen which is in the bottom of the screw on cap.

This ALWAYS clogs up if a bike sits too long. This will not only stop oil flow into the cylinders, it will also end up destroying the crankshaft bearings. ( they are fed oil too )

Take the right side cover off ( where the tach cable goes in ) and gently loosen the main feed line. If you have a steady, constant flow it should be ok. If not, the screen will have to be cleaned.

It's getting oil. In fact, oil is spraying all over the rim and tire from the left side exhaust. When the center fires, it puffs smoke. The thing smokes so much, the shop filled up with smoke from running it 5 minutes. I've been wondering if we can dial it down a bit, but right now we're trying to get it firing on all cylinders.

We need to take that right engine cover off to check the tach too. It seems really sluggish (as in it takes a full minute to respond). Tried spraying some lube down the cable. I wonder if the spring in the gauge is mushy.

The "spraying" oil may be oil left in the cylinder from when it was parked. Look for oil movement in the oil lines too. Once it's running on all three, a few runs thru the gears will clean it out. Then we'll see about the adjustment on the oil pump.

You can move the carbs to different cyclinders to see if that's your problem. Also, did you put brand new plugs in? Since you're having a problem with the right cylinder, check the spark plug cap to make sure it's connected to the spark plug wire.

When you remove the cover, be extra nice to the rubber grommet as they are not available from Kawasaki any more and repro ones run $15+

Remove the tach cable, start the engine and see if the tach drive spins. If it does NOT, you have a drive problem with the oil pump. Do not run it as the main bearings will not get oil.

We didn't put new plugs in, but we pulled the plugs and they look fine. We also tried to start it with each plug wire attached to a plug away from the engine and checked for spark. We had spark on all three. The rubber grommet for the tach drive is probably trashed- there's a lot of silicone smeared around it. As much smoke as we were getting, I really don't think there's a problem with the oil pump, but that cover is the next thing we plan to take off. We'll probably try swapping the carbs tomorrow- worth a shot before we tear them all apart again.

Spark plugs don't "dry out" with unleaded gas like they used to with leaded gas. It's possible they're not sparking under pressure. Maybe swap the left and right plugs if you don't have new plugs.

Not sure if you realize it but there is a three spark plug caddie under the seat. :dthumb: It's a black plastic bottom with a clear top. ( another part not to break :lol: )

When you remove the carbs, make sure you pull/twist them straight out. There is a phenolic ( plastic) heat shield insert that can break.

With the rubber grommet, either put the old one back in or find a similar solid plug at your local hardware/automotive store and put a hole in it.

2-Strokes LOVE fresh Plugs!

How important is fuel pressure to these things? It seems like the rightmost cylinder is being starved- the line only fills up when we pinch off the two left lines. The petcock definitely needs rebuilt or replaced. Right side runs intermittently, and the center cylinder still seems weak. The left is doing all the work, but we can get the other two going stronger by lifting their individual throttle cables. Makes me wonder if something is wrong with the throttle cable- like the amount of adjustment needed to even them up is out of the range at the top of the carb. Or they're not getting enough fuel to keep up. All the air screws are set the same- 1 full turn out. (Book says 1 1/4, so it should be slightly rich) And all the piston slides are set the same on the adjuster beside the throttle cable input.

They are gravity fed so not much "pressure". If your dad not worried about "museum correct", I would replace the vacuum petcock with this one.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Kawas...1662QQtcZphoto
http://i17.ebayimg.com/07/i/000/c8/d4/4db9_1.JPG
It's $58 for the complete unit. The rebuild kit for them is $48 and that does NOT include the vacuum diaphram which costs over $60.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Kawas...2987QQtcZphoto

I have one of those I'll be using on one of my triples. It has "On, off & reserve".

The carb adjustment may be off due to stretched cable or maybe just being out of whack. Turn in the adjustments on the carb tops and then take out as much slack as possible with the throttle adjustment. Then fine tune to get equal setting with the carb top adjustments.

If you still have the original fuel lines, that may be a problem too.

yup, 2 strokes are pickier about the plugs than women are about jewlery.

I know it is a hard thing to do, but now that you know it will run, stop trying and start at the top (tank) and work through each system, top to bottom, front to back. There is not a huge amount of things to go through. Make sure everything works the way it is is supposed to and is adjusted correctly. When the Battery, ignition timing, coils, plugs, oil pump, carbs, cables, sync, clutch and chain are all cleaned and adjusted to spec, Kick it. You will likely be rewarded, on about the 2nd or 3rd kick with smoky pleasure of the legal type. Enjoy.

Got Brakes? :D