Affliction folds

defector · 08-04-2009, 07:35 PM

[QUOTE=Triple;250557]Anyone who says Fedor fights nobodies and has-beens really needs to take another look at his record. The number of highly ranked fighters he has defeated at the height of each of their careers is what makes Fedor number one. He has had a few oddballs mixed in, but so do most other fighters who have been in the game as long as he has.

Even his last two opponents, who everyone now refers to as UFC rejects, were top-ten heavyweights when they faced him. Arlovski was coming off a five-fight winning streak. Sylvia was 7 and 2 in his nine fights prior to fighting Fedor, and not long before was the UFC's most dominant heavyweight champion ever.

To call the heavyweights outside of the UFC cans is a joke. If anyone really believes that Barnett, Overeem, Silva, Rogers and company couldn't compete with guys like Lesnar, Carwin, Dos Santos, and Velasquez, they don't really follow the sport.
QUOTE]

Although I believe Fedor is the best HW out there now, I feel like I will never see it proven. Short of Overeem, Josh Barnett, and Brett Rogers, I can't think of another HW fighter I would watch outside of the UFC.

Arlovski - last 2 fights ended in KO in under 2 mins TOTAL (Fedor and Rogers)
Pig Sylvia - last 2 fights ended in KO in under 1 min TOTAL (Fedor and Mercer)
Barnett - I don't know if or when he will be granted a license to fight again
Overeem - I think has potential to be a really good HW for years
Rogers - same as Overeem

Who did I miss?

Corey · 08-04-2009, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by defector

Who did I miss?

Werdum, who was a bust in his UFC tenure. I could see them lining up some "rematch" fights. StrikeForce does have Kevin Randleman and Renato Sobral on their payroll, both of whom have fought Fedor previously, though years ago.

defector · 08-04-2009, 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Triple

Antonio "Junior" Silva - humongous, looks like Frankenstein, former EliteXC heavyweight champion
You mean Bigfoot? First time I saw him fight, he got it handed to him in Bodog. But there are 3 well known fighters he has beaten - all past their prime: "Cabbage" in'07, Ricco Rodriguez (by split decision) in '08, Justin Eilers in '08 (this was a quick one, under 30 secs)

Gilbert "the Hurricane" Yvel - veteran of the game, schooled UFC's Cheik Kongo and recently destroyed the once great Pedro Rizzo
And just got KTFO by Josh Barnett pretty recently

Jeff "the Snowman" Monson - is on a seven fight winning streak, has lost only to Rizzo and Barnett in last eleven fights
The "once great" Rizzo, who just got destroyed?

Bobby Lashley - just slightly less deserved than Fedor vs. Lesnar, could be marketed to sell like crazy
I think he beat Bob Sapp recently? Looks to have the tools, though.

Blagoi Ivanov - a newcomer to MMA, but beat Fedor in a Sambo match last year, his first loss in eight years of competition; would also make a great match if Ivanov beats Fedor's brother Aleks in their upcoming bout
Relatively new, as you pointed out - but has one big name fight. Beat Fujita, who has lost 4 of his last 6 going back to '06

With the exception (possibly) of Lashley, nobody on this list is really impressive, IMO.

defector · 08-05-2009, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Triple

Barnett didn't knock him out; Yvel tapped because he couldn't get out from under him. Even though Yvel lost, he was doing almost as much damage to Barnett from his back as Barnett was doing to him from the mount. The problem with Yvel is that he is off and on; but when he's on, he destroys people.
You are correct, no KO. My mistake. I just remember him laying on his back, taking shots without defending himself.

His odds against UFC heavyweight strikers-- Kongo, Cro Cop, Dos Santos-- would be very good. I'm surprised he and Mirko never met in Japan, actually.
Don't all HW fighters with heavy hands have the ability to destroy people when they are "on"? No big revelation there.

Lashley is the one you find "possibly" impressive among this list of accomplished fighters..?
I say "possibly" with Lashley, as he has the speed that many HW fighters lack. Big, fast, HW fighters intrigue me, as they are not the norm. Same as Lesnar - his quickness/speed are intriguing. Just my own curiosity, I suppose.

Besides Lesnar, who does White employ that would make a better match than those outside of the UFC?

Shane Carwin? He has ONE win over a top 20 contender in Gabriel Gonzaga, putting him in the same boat as Brett Rogers.
See punchers chance, also very good wrestling. Gabriel Gonzage was relatively unknown until he unloaded the head kick on Cro Cop which put him against guys like Couture and Carwin. Carwin could very well end up in the same situation...

Cain Velasquez? He has ONE win over a top 20 contender in Cheik Kongo, putting him in the same boat as Brett Rogers.
Great wrestling, sometimes shaky striking. Not sure on the chin though, as I remember Congo stunned him a couple times in their fight. Do I think he can beat Fedor? Not sure, but I think it would be a good fight, and one I would like to see. Cheik Kongo is another one of those on / off fighters. He looked alright against Cro Cop, yes?

Junior dos Santos? He has ONE win over a top 20 contender in Fabricio Werdum, putting him in the same boat as Brett Rogers.
Worthy of a fight with Fedor off of a KO of Werdum? IMO, no.

Mirko Filipovic would fight Fedor anywhere, UFC or otherwise.
I would watch this fight every time. But, iirc Cro Cop is signed with the UFC, so it won't happen.
Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira had three shots already and couldn't capitalize.
No interest to me.
Five years ago a match with Randy Couture might have been competitive...
Same as Nogueira.

What I'm saying is, there isn't much of a talent gap between heavyweights inside the UFC and outside of the UFC.
I don't really disagree with this too much. I have said that I think the HW division overall (worldwide) is weak.
And besides that, Fedor doesn't have to prove anything to anyone; it's the number 2, 3, and 4's who should be pursuing him, not the other way around.
If Fedor doesn't fight either Rogers or Overeem in his first fight with Strikeforce, I will take all his talk about showing himself to be the best in the world as BS. He said he wanted to prove he was the best. If Lesnar was his best chance to prove it, then opportunity lost. Now he must take on the best of the rest, I suppose. He has probably 2 good fights in either league, but which 2 are the better fights? I would lean toward the UFC, since Lesnar would defend the belt. [See Overeem - champ since '07, but no title defenses due to injury. Yet has managed 3 or 4 fights in Japan?]
I also think Fedor vs Cain Velasquez or Carwin would be a good fight. I would also like to see Fedor vs Mir in a ground fight, but that's just me.

..

defector · 08-05-2009, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Triple

Was just checking out Strikeforce's website; they still list Paul Buentello as one of their guys, though I've heard he's just re-signed with the UFC. That would have been an interesting fight for Fedor because a) Buentello is a good boxer, and b) he crushed Fedor's little protege, Kirill Sidelnikov, in Affliction's last show in January.

They also have Bob Sapp, apparently. There's always Sapp to beat on...

I would watch that fight. Buentello is also another of those puncher's chance guys,IMO. I saw the "little Fedor" fight, and Buentello was snapping his head back with jabs. Complete striking clinic.
Sadly, my most vivid memory of Buentello was his 15 (or so) sec KO at the hands of Arlovski.

Bob Sapp, the original Kimbo Slice....

defector · 08-05-2009, 01:45 PM

When he started, he had a huge size, strength, and reach advantage over everyone (except possibly Semmy Schilt on reach). Last fight I saw of him, he was like 6'5 and something like 340lbs? Mammoth human being, without a doubt.
In my memory, he just mauled guys with akward punches and wore himself out, until he would get tapped out. Or he would start getting hit, and turtle up until the ref stopped it. Maybe this isn't the case...
Anyway, quite possibly my view of Sapp is skewed. He strikes me as a man who truly doesn't want to fight, but gets big bucks to step into the ring.

I would still watch Fedor take him down and slap a kimura on him, though.

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08-04-2009, 07:35 PM	#1
defector My balls, your chin Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: The desert of Az Moto: 929, SV650, YZ250 Posts: 1,917	[QUOTE=Triple;250557]Anyone who says Fedor fights nobodies and has-beens really needs to take another look at his record. The number of highly ranked fighters he has defeated at the height of each of their careers is what makes Fedor number one. He has had a few oddballs mixed in, but so do most other fighters who have been in the game as long as he has. Even his last two opponents, who everyone now refers to as UFC rejects, were top-ten heavyweights when they faced him. Arlovski was coming off a five-fight winning streak. Sylvia was 7 and 2 in his nine fights prior to fighting Fedor, and not long before was the UFC's most dominant heavyweight champion ever. To call the heavyweights outside of the UFC cans is a joke. If anyone really believes that Barnett, Overeem, Silva, Rogers and company couldn't compete with guys like Lesnar, Carwin, Dos Santos, and Velasquez, they don't really follow the sport. QUOTE] Although I believe Fedor is the best HW out there now, I feel like I will never see it proven. Short of Overeem, Josh Barnett, and Brett Rogers, I can't think of another HW fighter I would watch outside of the UFC. Arlovski - last 2 fights ended in KO in under 2 mins TOTAL (Fedor and Rogers) Pig Sylvia - last 2 fights ended in KO in under 1 min TOTAL (Fedor and Mercer) Barnett - I don't know if or when he will be granted a license to fight again Overeem - I think has potential to be a really good HW for years Rogers - same as Overeem Who did I miss?

08-05-2009, 01:45 PM	#6
defector My balls, your chin Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: The desert of Az Moto: 929, SV650, YZ250 Posts: 1,917	When he started, he had a huge size, strength, and reach advantage over everyone (except possibly Semmy Schilt on reach). Last fight I saw of him, he was like 6'5 and something like 340lbs? Mammoth human being, without a doubt. In my memory, he just mauled guys with akward punches and wore himself out, until he would get tapped out. Or he would start getting hit, and turtle up until the ref stopped it. Maybe this isn't the case... Anyway, quite possibly my view of Sapp is skewed. He strikes me as a man who truly doesn't want to fight, but gets big bucks to step into the ring. I would still watch Fedor take him down and slap a kimura on him, though.