Buell is done, finished, gone

[Homeslice]

Originally Posted by derf

If they can sell a bike that appeals to the cool boy sportbike crowd, that has the image of a gixxer then they would break into the sport bike market. We can all agree that buells were pretty good bikes, but they didnt have the cool boy image that a gixxer has, they appealed to folks that were already in the sportbike market and liked a bike that can handle. What it comes down to is that if you create the image then you sell the bike. More people ride to look cool than to enjoy riding.

HD doesn't need to get into sportbikes, they don't need to and they would fail anyway. The only thing they might want to consider is offering something for $10K or less so that younger people can afford it. Then again, why should they do anything? They are profitable enough as is.

[Amber Lamps]

Originally Posted by Homeslice

HD doesn't need to get into sportbikes, they don't need to and they would fail anyway. The only thing they might want to consider is offering something for $10K or less so that younger people can afford it. Then again, why should they do anything? They are profitable enough as is.

Dude, haven't you ever heard of the Sportster? $7000 for the 883 version.

http://www.harley-davidson.com/wcm/C...jsp#/family/sp

[derf]

Originally Posted by TIGGER

Dude, haven't you ever heard of the Sportster? $7000 for the 883 version.

http://www.harley-davidson.com/wcm/C...jsp#/family/sp

Good luck finding a sporty for MSRP, well now maybe, but a year, 2 years ago they were selling for over 10k, and if you didnt want to pay that much some other poor slob would come in the next day and pay it

[Homeslice]

Originally Posted by TIGGER

Dude, haven't you ever heard of the Sportster? $7000 for the 883 version.

http://www.harley-davidson.com/wcm/C...jsp#/family/sp

I didn't know they were so cheap.......my bad.

[derf]

Originally Posted by Homeslice

HD doesn't need to get into sportbikes, they don't need to and they would fail anyway. The only thing they might want to consider is offering something for $10K or less so that younger people can afford it. Then again, why should they do anything? They are profitable enough as is.

I can agree with what you say on this. Except for one point, the reason that HD exists is to make money, and they want to make more than they already have. They do want to break into the sportbike market, thats why they own buell and MV. they just dont think they can do it with their own name, I also think that they think the HD name on a sport bike will hurt the image with the bad ass biker crowd so they dont want to risk it, but they dont mind introducing a sportish bike under the xr name.

Yes they do need to introduce an american bike under 10k, in fact they need to build a sportster type of bike that the average construction worker can buy, something cheap no frills no nothing, just and engine and 2 wheels. The blast would be the perfect bike, except it will eat into the sportster people who can just barely afford it and instead get crappy loans through HD finance, which is what got them in trouble in the first place.

Again, just my opinion

[FT BSTRD]

Originally Posted by derf

I can agree with what you say on this. Except for one point, the reason that HD exists is to make money, and they want to make more than they already have. They do want to break into the sportbike market, thats why they own buell and MV. they just dont think they can do it with their own name, I also think that they think the HD name on a sport bike will hurt the image with the bad ass biker crowd so they dont want to risk it, but they dont mind introducing a sportish bike under the xr name.

Yes they do need to introduce an american bike under 10k, in fact they need to build a sportster type of bike that the average construction worker can buy, something cheap no frills no nothing, just and engine and 2 wheels. The blast would be the perfect bike, except it will eat into the sportster people who can just barely afford it and instead get crappy loans through HD finance, which is what got them in trouble in the first place.

Again, just my opinion

Honestly, I sell to "the average construction worker" every day. They come in with rolls of bills covered in butt sweat to buy a Harley they have saved for.

They wouldn't buy a lower priced, "no frills, no nothing" bike because everyone would know it was a "no frills, no nothing" bike. The Sportsters are like Kryptonite to most. Dyna frame, Road King, Heritage, or Geezer Glide.

Otherwise, they walk out the door.

[derf]

Originally Posted by FT BSTRD

Honestly, I sell to "the average construction worker" every day. They come in with rolls of bills covered in butt sweat to buy a Harley they have saved for.

They wouldn't buy a lower priced, "no frills, no nothing" bike because everyone would know it was a "no frills, no nothing" bike. The Sportsters are like Kryptonite to most. Dyna frame, Road King, Heritage, or Geezer Glide.

Otherwise, they walk out the door.

Exactly, but that brings me back to the point, HD financed as much as they can and got sucked into a ton of bad finance deals, thats where their finacial troubles are, not selling bikes, they need to price bikes that folks can afford so that HD financial doesnt have to take on bad credit deals

[FT BSTRD]

Originally Posted by derf

Exactly, but that brings me back to the point, HD financed as much as they can and got sucked into a ton of bad finance deals, thats where their finacial troubles are, not selling bikes, they need to price bikes that folks can afford so that HD financial doesnt have to take on bad credit deals

It's a chicken and egg. They make high priced bikes because lower priced bikes don't sell. They have to finance these high priced bikes to people who can't afford them.

In the end, there are simply not enough buyers to keep the balls spinning at HD. It's a house of cards.

[derf]

Originally Posted by FT BSTRD

It's a chicken and egg. They make high priced bikes because lower priced bikes don't sell. They have to finance these high priced bikes to people who can't afford them.

In the end, there are simply not enough buyers to keep the balls spinning at HD. It's a house of cards.

Yup.

But give it a year or 2 and HD will be selling the same volume that they sold 2 years ago, I also truly believe that Buell (or an HD badged buellish sportbike) will have another bike out again within a 2 year window, my guess is winter of 2011-2012 you will hear news of it. Thats why Erik Buell is being kept on as a consultant. Just my opinion.

[FT BSTRD]

Originally Posted by derf

Yup.

But give it a year or 2 and HD will be selling the same volume that they sold 2 years ago, I also truly believe that Buell (or an HD badged buellish sportbike) will have another bike out again within a 2 year window, my guess is winter of 2011-2012 you will hear news of it. Thats why Erik Buell is being kept on as a consultant. Just my opinion.

Word from the factory folks is no HD branded sportbike, period. Test markets showed that a HD branded sportbike was a big fail.

Erik started at HD in the engineering area. He is finishing up in the engineering area.

My guess is that we will see some (more) of his design going into the XR1200 and XR1200R programs particularly if DMG creates a XR1200 race series.